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Monday, June 09, 2008

Can Kenyan Voters Do The Shocking Thing American Voters Did?

...Or did they already do it in December 2007?

Guest post by Barry O.

It is very interesting that in the United States political analysts and pollsters have not noted based on exit polls and other surveys that the majority of Democratic Presidential Candidate Barrack Obama supporters are considered wealthy educated Americans. Hilary Clinton who recently conceded defeat to Senator Obama, drew her support from America’s working class and rural voters.

Why is this worth noting?

Well to begin with Hilary Clinton is a educated and very wealthy American, who was able to loan her campaign some $11 million to keep it afloat. Barrack Obama on the other hand is by all means very educated having attended Ivy League schools such as Columbia and Harvard, he is however not wealthy.

In the United States as in most countries in the world higher education, particularly post-secondary education requires financial resources. In Kenya access to higher education is even more cumbersome and relative wealth is often needed to secure the fees necessary for a student to be able to afford higher learning. As they both share nearly the same views on most issues, from a Kenyan perspective one would argue that Hilary Clinton would be the more favourable candidate (her being a female notwithstanding) compared to Barrack Obama. The reason for this is because she is white first and foremost (from a Kenyan lense think tribalism), she is older, she is wealthy, she is very educated and she has a famous name.

Obama on the other hand only has his education in comparison, as he is Black (from a Kenyan lense think un-electable) he is rich, but not wealthy and he does not have a popular name. So how then does a man who lacks many of the characteristics Kenyan voters look for in their preferred presidential candidates win the nomination in the Democratic Party?

He takes a bold stand against a popular cause that he, like the majority of Americans feel is not right and takes up the cause for change. Americans have shown they can look past irrelevant issues and focus on what counts and matters. If the same thinking is applied to Kenyans how can you not vote for Prime Minister Odinga ( majority of Kenyans did vote for him in 2007 any way) when, this marriage of convenience/coalition government ends?

Who introduced the bill to make Kenya a one party state? Who argued for maintaining this policy when Moi indicated he was going to repeal section 2a of the constitution? What in heavens name has Uhuru done since he was plucked from obscurity by Moi to make him a serious candidate for President or even an MP? Kindly let me know because I know Raila fought for democracy, I know Raila exposed the Artur brothers, I know Raila led the campaign against the Wako Draft amongst others, I know Raila has been fighting for the de-centralization of government, I know Raila led the second liberation which was essential for Kibaki to become president in 2002. I know Raila is the only mainstream politician in Kenya who represents a cosmopolitan constituency.

46 comments:

Anonymous said...

Kumekucha you and the world will be shocked at how Kenyans will mvote in the next election.

If you thot December 2007 ilukua kitu basi muta-collapse in 2012.

Phil said...

Thank you Barry O for this. Its a refreshing read after cyber-stalkers swamped the last post with irrelevant comments.

Kenyans already out-did Americans in 2002 (remember project Uhuru?) and again in 2007. Obama is not president, not just yet. John Kerry and Al Gore both came so close, yet so far.

But to important things first. Not only did Raila do all those things you have listed, but also has been feted abroad and received international democracy awards for his efforts in improving democratization in Kenya.

The is also the first presidential candidate in Kenya's multi-party history to have won 6 out of 8 provinces in a presidential election. (Kibaki and Moi can only wish!)

Recently again, Raila made history as the first African leader to criticize the goings-on in Zimbabwe. His comments at an international conference put a question-mark on President Mbeki and I am sure will change the way business is conducted with regard to Zimbabwe.

I know that leaders like Mandela, Gandhi, Nyerere come along only once in a life time. I have NO hesitation whatsoever in adding Raila Amolo Odinga (aka Arap Mibei, Chuny Piny, Owad ga Akinyi, Agwambo, Chuma Lieth) to this list.

Kimi Raikkonen said...

Since Raila represents a cosmopolitan constituency, as he himself often claims, why did he go to Nyanza for a thanksgiving homecoming party? What message was he sending? Why did he go to thank and celebrate with Luos FIRST before he did so with the people of Langata who voted for him so that he could become an MP BEFORE he could become the Prime Minister? Does this not prove that he is a prisoner of tribal thinking, as we have asserted all along, contrary to his blind supporters delusions? Kenya will never reach the standards of American politics until we learn not to look at our politics through tribal lenses.
Raila is no Obama and will never be, and you need to learn to stop cheating yourselves.

Anonymous said...

A poster ad for Raila odinga is quite unnecessary at this stage. Most kenyans appreciate his contribution to this country and against the backdrop of many of our politicians he has no peers.
However that does not entail we "reward" him with the presidency . The man is a leader in his own right, however he has dissapointed in
terms of team selection. His ministerial appointments were far from inspirational and were more an echo of the maxim "the means justify the end". What we require is a total generational change in kenya .Not in terms of age but in terms of ideas . Is there another Obama out there ???!!! We need to free ourselves from party dictatorships and personality cults . Otherwise expect no change , just the usual game of musical chairs .

SimSim

Anonymous said...

Kimi you hit the nail with your remark that Kenyans need to learn to stop cheating themselves although, the truth is, they never will learn because they love being cheated and will continue doing so, in every aspect of their lives and especially when it comes to politics. They just love to close their eyes and continue dreaming. Dreaming about a better Kenya without doing anything themselves to make it that way. And then there are those in whose interest it is that it stays this way. The likes of Christopher Kyalo and Sam Okello (not to forget his 'wife' Hellen who is in the best sense 'a hell of a bitch' and as that outshining these two 'men'). Why I say this? Because Sam is only doing what the bitch at his side is telling him and now that Chris has joined them in South Bend, she has two 'men' to tell what and how to do things (in and outside her bed - all in accordance with her book 'While on my Knees' - do I have to say more about her favourite position? I guess not because I assume that all of you have some imagination what I mean when describing 'a menage a trois' between Hellen, Sam and their latest aquisition, 'yours truly, Christopher Kyalo' who left his wife and two children in Kenya because he 'missed' being able to open a Paypal account. But I am sure, his many friends will even take up a loan to help him. Am I right?

Anonymous said...

Kimi you hit the nail with your remark that Kenyans need to learn to stop cheating themselves although, the truth is, they never will learn because they love being cheated and will continue doing so, in every aspect of their lives and especially when it comes to politics. They just love to close their eyes and continue dreaming. Dreaming about a better Kenya without doing anything themselves to make it that way. And then there are those in whose interest it is that it stays this way. The likes of Christopher Kyalo and Sam Okello (not to forget his 'wife' Hellen who is in the best sense 'a hell of a bitch' and as that outshining these two 'men'). Why I say this? Because Sam is only doing what the bitch at his side is telling him and now that Chris has joined them in South Bend, she has two 'men' to tell what and how to do things (in and outside her bed - all in accordance with her book 'While on my Knees' - do I have to say more about her favourite position? I guess not because I assume that all of you have some imagination what I mean when describing 'a menage a trois' between Hellen, Sam and their latest aquisition, 'yours truly, Christopher Kyalo' who left his wife and two children in Kenya because he 'missed' being able to open a Paypal account. But I am sure, his many friends will even take up a loan to help him. Am I right?

Anonymous said...

Kimi you hit the nail with your remark that Kenyans need to learn to stop cheating themselves although, the truth is, they never will learn because they love being cheated and will continue doing so, in every aspect of their lives and especially when it comes to politics. They just love to close their eyes and continue dreaming. Dreaming about a better Kenya without doing anything themselves to make it that way. And then there are those in whose interest it is that it stays this way. The likes of Christopher Kyalo and Sam Okello (not to forget his 'wife' Hellen who is in the best sense 'a hell of a bitch' and as that outshining these two 'men'). Why I say this? Because Sam is only doing what the bitch at his side is telling him and now that Chris has joined them in South Bend, she has two 'men' to tell what and how to do things (in and outside her bed - all in accordance with her book 'While on my Knees' - do I have to say more about her favourite position? I guess not because I assume that all of you have some imagination what I mean when describing 'a menage a trois' between Hellen, Sam and their latest aquisition, 'yours truly, Christopher Kyalo' who left his wife and two children in Kenya because he 'missed' being able to open a Paypal account. But I am sure, his many friends will even take up a loan to help him. Am I right?

Anonymous said...

Kimi you hit the nail with your remark that Kenyans need to learn to stop cheating themselves although, the truth is, they never will learn because they love being cheated and will continue doing so, in every aspect of their lives and especially when it comes to politics. They just love to close their eyes and continue dreaming. Dreaming about a better Kenya without doing anything themselves to make it that way. And then there are those in whose interest it is that it stays this way. The likes of Christopher Kyalo and Sam Okello (not to forget his 'wife' Hellen who is in the best sense 'a hell of a bitch' and as that outshining these two 'men'). Why I say this? Because Sam is only doing what the bitch at his side is telling him and now that Chris has joined them in South Bend, she has two 'men' to tell what and how to do things (in and outside her bed - all in accordance with her book 'While on my Knees' - do I have to say more about her favourite position? I guess not because I assume that all of you have some imagination what I mean when describing 'a menage a trois' between Hellen, Sam and their latest aquisition, 'yours truly, Christopher Kyalo' who left his wife and two children in Kenya because he 'missed' being able to open a Paypal account. But I am sure, his many friends will even take up a loan to help him. Am I right?

Anonymous said...

Kimi you hit the nail with your remark that Kenyans need to learn to stop cheating themselves although, the truth is, they never will learn because they love being cheated and will continue doing so, in every aspect of their lives and especially when it comes to politics. They just love to close their eyes and continue dreaming. Dreaming about a better Kenya without doing anything themselves to make it that way. And then there are those in whose interest it is that it stays this way. The likes of Christopher Kyalo and Sam Okello (not to forget his 'wife' Hellen who is in the best sense 'a hell of a bitch' and as that outshining these two 'men'). Why I say this? Because Sam is only doing what the bitch at his side is telling him and now that Chris has joined them in South Bend, she has two 'men' to tell what and how to do things (in and outside her bed - all in accordance with her book 'While on my Knees' - do I have to say more about her favourite position? I guess not because I assume that all of you have some imagination what I mean when describing 'a menage a trois' between Hellen, Sam and their latest aquisition, 'yours truly, Christopher Kyalo' who left his wife and two children in Kenya because he 'missed' being able to open a Paypal account. But I am sure, his many friends will even take up a loan to help him.

Am I right?

Phil said...

Anon@12.55,12.56,12.57am

Sasa unajifanya n'gombe ukamuliwe na nani?

Hizo umalaya zenu na Briner mukisha ambukizana maugonjwa za zinaa utatoa hapa. Na Ukae ukijua umetambulika kama ulele porn poster. Tunakujua na ukizidi tuta ku xpose lakini sio kabla ya kuku gota mangoto.

Anonymous said...

I am waiting for Hellen Okello's usual slogan 'Sam Okello for President' which she posted here many times before.
One suggestion, Hellen: maybe you should now say 'Sam Okello for President and Christopher Kyalo for Prime Minister' and don't forget to add: In voting for these two 'men', you also get Her Excellency Hellen Okello, the borne-again Lucy Kibaki. What a nightmare!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Anonymous said...

Kimi, I love and hate your way of thinking, you have been consistently reductionist and simplistic in your views and you want to say that is what Kenyas want. Cna you braden your world view and think beyond the blinds, I remember you were the first to write here in January about the dreams of Primier and a coalission govt, It is rather suprising that you have never acknowledged your failures. Any way, to enlighten you abit, it is not all those who read your posts who make choices based on them coz, they cannot constitute an agenda, idea of conviction which you simply lack in all your comments and views, It is not a wonder then thet you have failed to help even at the caln level, so what more can we expect from you beyond your household (read nuclear).

Anonymous said...

Chris

Eh What is all this nonsense about. I hate moderation coz it slows things but if those are the comments that people are going to post then pls moderate.
I didn't even read the post....Pls restore sanity to this blog even if we will have 10 people comment so be it!!

Ivy

Anonymous said...

I see that even somebody like Phil who told us before that you have to be ' a learned friend' of the English language if you want to communicate on an intelligent level, is now changing to Swahili while commenting here. But he may be wrong because not everybody who ¡counts' in Kenya does speak this 'language' - the real important people still prefer to speak the only language which counts: Kikuyu. Or at least take up some lessons (preferably with an intelligent Tanzanian) before continuing posting here in a language you are not capable to speak or give your 'elaborate' comments to somebody who is making the necessary corrections. Otherwise you continue demonstrating your low grade education - but this is not a surprise for somebody living in Kibera and praying for some miracles to happen.

Phil said...

Gotcha! Anon@1.31; I intentionally made that post because I knew it would hit a raw nerve, and sure it has!

You are the one and same person who is insisting on posting irrelevant comments here about Okellos, Briner and Kyalo. You are the same person who purports to know-it-all. What you fail to appreciate is we have known you ever since you made your first comment here in 2006.

I have a good idea of who you are and why you have this grudge with Chris and Kumekucha blog. I am contemplating coming to meet you at your favourite joint along waiyaki way in westlands. May be then, you will not be anonymous anymore.

I am have no regrets of having been born and brought up in Kibera. I do not think it reduces my being human nor proves the level of my education.

Your comments and the fact that you are posting anonymously exposes you as psychopath who has no regrets about their past well recorded criminal actions.

I repeat - endelea kujifanya n'gombe, mimi nita kukamua hapa hapa then niku gote mangoto mzito kweli. Naona ulisha zinyoa ma dreadlocks na hiyo superiority complex yako inaku daganya sana.

Anonymous said...

I agree with phil kenyans already out did Americans in 2002. So far RAO has out done Obama he actually won the presidency and he had to fight in a far more primitive system....

RAO is no saint but for a guy of his generation there is not a peer in sight that even comes close......

It is us kenyans who have allowed ourselves to be lead by idiots cause abviously the truth about how our leaders influnce on our lives has not dawned on us........

We have a whole generation and a half that has no clue of what a decently run gava can archive for its people.......

Basics like town planning....most kenyans have never seen a proper planned and managed town cause none exists in kenya

my point is we have come to accept such low standards it hurts...

The kenyan economy can only be described as a mickymouse economy the poorest province in SA is richer than kenya.....yet some kenyans feel wealthy in this little pond......THATS THE PROBLEM.
LOW EXPECTATIONS....

Where in kenya can you go and see an organised public system.....
Go to lennena school that used to be a school now its more like a pig stye........Even the great university of NBI is but a pale shadwow of its formaer self....

Some of us old enough have seen this country systematical getting worse as a nation while some people piled individual wealth in foreign accounts......

All the big manoey makers don't invest at home....we simply need to pay more attention to our politics....or we are doomed and that means you and me must be more vocal at all times on every issue...

.make the right noises and no idiotic politician will dare present themselves to be voted....like we now have caricatures of humans running around claiming all sorts of crap.

We must support the likes of RAO caues so far he has proved he has some sense......his choice of cabinet colleagues is a reflection of the political reality.....there is war, politicians are notorious for prostitution its a balancing act a necesarry evil Rome was not built in a day it would have been better if we the people only voted decent guys so whoever he chose would still deliver.....

The problem now is that some crooks represent alot of political clout thanks to us voting them in lets not turn that into RAO's problem...

Neither wise men nor fools can work without tools.....

lets start by electing the right 'tools'

RAO is no magician.
Give him the tools...


Sir Alex

Anonymous said...

I can see where Phil is coming from and I tend to agree with him.

Here is proof that shows KK had already identified its enemies.

Slightly under one year ago, right here on KK, there was once a post by Chris, and there also an observation in a comment by Benji on the same post that has never been satisfactorily answered! Read all the dossier at this archived post at this link.

Is it Yote Ya Wezekana Bila Moi or is it Bila Mwai

Before all that, Chris had published a post that showed us the direction of where Kumekucha's enemies posted porn comments from. Here it is.

Online Forensic Experts Point Out Possible Identity Of Porn Poster To Kumekucha

Now guys, as Benji has put it, can you see who is behind the latest comments revolving around the same subject? When you analyse the writing style you wont miss it.

Of course, although against blog policy, IP addresses might be supplied later when we zero in on the abusive 'nameless' idiot.

Benji if you are reading this, your wise words are greatly missed on this forum

Blogger DAN

Anonymous said...

What has raila odinga contributed towards democracy? organising a coup in which more than 1500 kenyans died? Preaching kikuyu hatred? undermining the Vice-President? It is expremely foolish for anyone to put raila odinga in the same list with Julius Nyerere. Have Kenyans forgotten the molasses scandal? Or more recently, why did this "nationalist" organise a home coming in Bondo? Is he the MP for Bondo? Or is he the king of the kavirondo region? Raila is like a hungry dog looking for some bone to chew! It is good that The President found it wise to deny ministerial responsibility. I wish he could use his time to eliviate the jaluo subjects from poverty and Aids. Kioko, BC, Canada.

Anonymous said...

And why is Raila seeking validation from Kikuyu anway? Why not just focus on building the nation? For Kenyans? Very sorry to steal (momentary) attention from the porn as KK reaches to new and even greater heights.

Anonymous said...

I am sorry i dont do this but Kioko of BC or whatever (Does it matter anyway?) as Raila is elevating poverty and AIDs in Nyanza. What are you doing personally to elevating the vices that threaten the Akamba people... Water, Famine, Poverty, Illetracy and many more.
By the way AIDs is a kenyan problem and not luo problem...Research more or better still ask Daniel Waweru

Ivy

Taabu said...

Kioko BC,
True to form your sickness is back with a vegeance. You are in good company bro and the choke has gone cancerous. I thought going mute and hibernating can usefully tranform an empty shell lakini wapi?

Thanks for crawling out of the wordworks. Boy and you come in pairs following many others. As you spew diatribe focussed and thinking with what sperates your lower limbs indulge and enjoy, won't you? Folly by any shade remain just that. What a consistent OAF?

Phil said...

Anon 3.20am,

Even as you try to divert attention, your style keeps giving you away.

Raila will never seek validation from Kiuks - on the contrary it is the kiuks who need to integrate with the rest of Kenyans who gave their verdict in the last elections.

I'll tell you what; drop the childish comments you have been leaving here, we shall forget it and move on.

Lakini ukiendelea kujifanya nyani ndizi ni mingi hapa, and I shall be glad to feed you. As you will have noticed, moderation is removed and you are free to re-start porn posting. It is all up to you, but you have been warned!

Anonymous said...

Kenyans should be brave enough to face the truth about the 82 coup. kenya was a one party state. That simply means there was no real democracy. Most kenyans celebrated that coup....back then it was clear to those who had lived under colonialism and soon after independence that our country was going to the dogs....

it is this new generation who like have said before have never seen kenya in its full glory that wonder why anyone wanted to take over by a coup...or why would anyone be so bitter at tha time...
somebody here even once said that at that time kenay was ok.....THAT IS the SHIDA in this country too many people with very low expectations....that is the curse of our nation....

in their ignorance all they see in negative in the word coup.... call it a coup call it war almost any important country was curved out of warfare.

To those intellectaully challenged and too lazy to do any meaningfull research before they engage their loud mouths....AT TIMES A COUP is the only way to get rid of leaders who no longer represent the will of the people.

The Mau mau were by definition attempting a coup.....yet we call them liberation fighters...it all depends on how you choose to look at it.

I'm not privy to the details of RAOs involvement but I hope he was involved....kenyans who had seen a better kenya wanted a break........all supported it. Majority kenyans of that time had no problem with the coup....
Oh how we have lowered our standards since then.......

The line of thinking goes like this he was is a coup, a coup is wrong, he is a bad guy....end of reasoning......If only human affairs were that simple.....

Besides it was meant to be a bloodless coup untill some weak kneed idiots bailed out the last minute. Thanks to them blood was shed.

kioko from canada who are your heros in kenya and what have they done for you? I guess your in canada cause your heros in kenya have screwed the country so bad you don't want to live in it.

You can't judge RAO in isolation you must measure him against his contemporaries some of whom i wish are your heros then lets see how they fare.....your sounding like a footbal fun in city stadi or mchongwano in prima.


Your embarssing kenyans home and abroad.

Or you just hate the fact that kalooser your tribes man just does not have it......stop clinging to him find a new leader.....I believe you have better options than that...better still vie for the same post yourself nobody has stopped you certainly not Raila.

RAO never preached kikuyu hatrade....you read too much in statements....the much spoken of and unfortunate 'adui yetu' comment by RAO was more to mean our opponents and indeed at that time there was a kikuyu move to dominate kenya....all he asked was to vote their guy out.....which we did.

That move was an adui yetu move by the kikuyu, it was a jinga move and thank God it came a cropper. They should revise it to include all kenyans on equall standing.

Sir Alex

Anonymous said...

Phil

Do you or anyone else have a copy (and can post or provide a link) of the harmonised manifestos for implementation.

I'd like to see the key sector, institutional and legal reforms and priorities.

Back to this post, kenyan voters exercised their mandate well turned up in large numbers and largely voted for candidates of their choice, as pointed out both in 2002 and 2007.

in future elections what needs to be addressed and corrected is a comprehensive electoral process redesign that will discipline and rein in errant aspirants (those engaging in malpractices such as bribing, ballot stuffing, rigging, intimidation, violence, etc). unless stern measures are taken against these people, then we can expect more pangas to be ferried in GK vehicles, more communities to be hostile to "outsiders", and other forms of malpractices with impunity.

i think the kenyan voter has matured considerably, its the leaders and the institutions (+ constitution) that continue to let kenya down, and not surprisingly the leaders are not making any significant progress in leading reforms because the chaos is more beneficial to them due to chronic manipulation rather than orderly and due process.

UrXlnc

Kwale said...

Chris,

You don’t need to ask who I am. My name says it all. It’s only myself and Mzee wa Kijiji of all Kumekuchans bloggers who bears the name of where we come from. Everyone else seems to have all these modern fancy names, which is ok.
The only difference is, I am not your kind of regular Joe type of a guy, but more of Jack-the –lad type. (I am sure you understand the rhyming slang language).
You can include me in the list of right minded people who have kept this blog going, people like, Vikii, Derek, Kimi Raikonnen, M-Pesa, Daniel Waweru, Mzee wa Kijiji, Antonio, Mcheku with exception of Knoppix, the only ODMer who seems to have some kind of senses. Bless his heart.

What are my motives? Nothing out of the ordinary, only I would like you to accept PNU and Kibaki won the 2007 election and then move on with your lives. I have repeatedly said if you have any evidence of rigging or fraud let the world know by presenting it to the court of law. You tend to forget there many people in Kenya who voted for PNU just like you voted for ODM. And just because you have this fixation with Raila Odinga does not mean every Kenyan should vote for him. You (ODMers) like to worship him in this mawkish sentimental way, so much so you cannot accept defeat!

On a lighter note, it would very nice of you if you can clean up this meretricious blog, too much filth, too tacky and too much of shoddy reporting. Otherwise I am this foible type of character - harmless but vocal.

By the way why is Kenya not represented at commonwealth head of state meeting in London?

Phil said...

UrXlnc,

I do not have it, the just launched Vision 2030 that is.

We still do not have the full version. Government is behaving as if it is a classified document. I saw Raila and Kibaki carry away copies from the launch - I am sure we will get a link soon.

Will post as soon as I get.

Thanks

Anonymous said...

YAAAAH - WA
" Let Us Reject Being Mere Spectators in Life, To Becoming Masters Of Our Own Destiny………………. Koro to you all, I want to resait a poem for you and I wis you were there
to watch me...

When Kisum bekem a siiti,
Suzzana Owiyo bekem Witney Youstoone

When Kisum bekem a siiti,
Dennis Oliech bekem Thiieerry Heenri,

When Kisum bekem a siiti,
Louis Otieno bekem Lari King

When Kisum bekem a siiti,
Obama became a Seneta,


When Kisum bekem a siiti,
lek victoria bekem an osen

When Kisum bekem a siiti
all the mbuta in the lek bekem wales

When Kisum bekem a siiti
all fising boats bekem sips

When Kisum bekem a siiti
all omena bekem saks

When Kisum bekem a siiti,
all fisamen became sip captens

When Kisum bekem a siiti,
Gidi Gidi Maji Maji bekem Boys-To-Men OMera

When Kisum bekem a siiti,
Mercy Myra bekem Jennifer Lopez

When Kisum bekem a siiti,
Achieng Abura bekem Queen Latifah

Soult i....
bt do we Say....
when Obama becomes presitent.....
all luo's will become AmeriKans

YAWAA
call me on my samsuuung.... on my soosiall(social) line....( PHONE NUMBER
NOT SOWN FOR SEECURITII PAPASES

BADO MAPAMBANO,MAPAMBANO!!!!! MAPAAAMBANNOO!!!!!!
....Haya u can join me
BADO MAPAMBANO,MAPAMBANO!!!!! MAPAAAMBANNOO!!!!!!

NICE TIME!!!!



Tho' tis hard, I'd ratha luz honorably than with dishonesty....... !!

Fave said...

Kwale,
It was a bad morning for me until this totally irreverent comment brought a smile to my face.
You apply the principle that if no one dances to the beat of your drums, you can beat them yourself and dance to the noise. I quote you below

..'You can include me in the list of right minded people who have kept this blog going, people like, Vikii, Derek, Kimi Raikonnen, M-Pesa, Daniel Waweru, Mzee wa Kijiji, Antonio, Mcheku...'
Apart from Knopix you mention the most insidious, puerile, hateful, distateful ethnocentric people this side of Mungiki as right thinking! You mention a cabal in the payrol of the dictator whose sole aim is to spew injurious thoughts and words as right thinking? Trust me, I now know what drives you that was insightful.

Anonymous said...

Fave yawa, Kwale was just trying to consolidate support....Don't you remember "Birds of the same feather flock together" ...



Ivy

Anonymous said...

thanks Phil, will keep an eye out for it.

i hope it addresses conflict resolution because most of the nonsense on this blog is an extension of the leadership nonsense resulting from a lack of clear guidelines on conflict resolution. first conflict is not necessarily an evil but a sign of diverse interests and thought (beleifs, practices, etc). conflict also does not necessarily need to lead to acrimony and violence or viciousness either physical or abusive. it appear that most kenyans and some bloggers here have adopted the stance that if you are not of the same opinion then you are lost and a looser (at least the arguments presented are aimed to make loosers of the other side, check kwale's argument above).

presenting an argument to expound on a position is different from presenting an argument solely for the purpose of ridicule or to demean others. some of the arguments are shallow and patronizing and leave no room for further debate, yet we all know theres a problem and we need each other to solve the problem.

followed by the stereotyping (pnu supporters blah blah, odm supporters blah blah) and the inevitable, I am not like so and so, am a cut above the rest and similar sort of juvenile nonsense.

clearly there has been a conflict of interest in the run up to elections, in the election period and past the election period. even after the peace accord there are still more conflicts unfolding in leadership from the petty (pecking order, decorum of security, etc) to operational (who supervises who, what etc)

and one thing emerges clear from all this, we absolutely have no methodology for conflict resolution. some were too used to the big man approach, run to daddy for a roadside declaration, and there is the first problem, fence sitters or hands off approach is radically different for these operators, leaving a major vaccum. i could go on, but people lets understand that conflicts are not evil and neither is diversity in opinion. what we need to do is structure a methodology for engaging in healthy discussion of the variety of options, and create room for each to pursue their preferences and where only a single path is desirable then find intelligent conflict resolution and management. and remember effective management is proactive.

i hope we've seen the last of the garbage from the previous thread

UrXlnc

Fave said...

Ivy,
True, birds of the same feather flock together. Lakini, a list of demagogues in training can not be called right thinking.
Someone had to stop Kwale before he started believing in his own version of the truth. I took upon that painful task, and I believe I deserve some appreciation.

UrXlnc @6:35 AM great post!

Taabu said...

Fave/Ivy/Mrembo/Ciku,
Please spare folks for they complete the equation with non balancing figures. I fear for the obtuse insult on Knoppix. The chap is being draged into a den ful of fleas and we better order the best DOOM to fumigate him lest we lose his head. Of birds and gathering it is the same OLD trick premised on FALSE SECURITY IN NUMBERS.

As Knoppix wont to remind all and sundry many should troop back to their schools for refund. Being corrosive is no virture for your own fabric is vulrenable. Rub it on if you must but prepapre for the TEAR and wear too.

Anonymous said...

Barry O, this is a good post, thank you for reiterating something that some of us had forgotten. The truth is always refreshing to hear.

The thing I dont understand in this blog nowadays is why people feel compelled to come and out each other here. People write nice posts and someone comes to post rubbish comments repetitively. Some people have taken it upon themselves to expose Chris and I think that is a bit childish.

Now that we know he lived in Mombasa and is now in America what has it helped the anonymous poster with? We have read he cannot open a paypal account in Africa time and again, he has left his family in Kenya, blah blah blah! Sooooo? Grow up! and honestly its getting old and tiring!

What do you want kumekuchans to help you with? By the way even if Chris wants to go to America to get more money isn't that his right? Or is he expected to eat stones? He does not force anyone to read this blog, you do it of your own volition if you are feeling used cause Chris is in America, go cry a river if you want to and stop wasting our time here with loads and loads of idiotic comments. You have a problem with Kumekucha and Sam Okello sort it out with them dont come here to tell us we have been used, if you have been used, you have let yourself to be used so speak for yourself. I am still happy to read political and other sane issues on this blog.

People sound so bitter that raw notes cost $15 has anybody stopped you from paying the subscription for the raw notes? Chris hasn't forced anyone to pay the money, if you dont want them you dont pay, simple! I dont have the money so I dont pay for it, but I am not here boring people with bitter cries of raw notes! What is the point of coming here to sing about raw notes all the time?

Chris, can you please sort your domestics away from the blog? People are publishing emails exchanged between you and them for what purpose? I dont get it. I am sick and tired of this rubbish and I dont want to see this nonsense here again. Please return moderation if you need to, there's no need of flooding our eyes with crap day in day out.

-Mrembo

Anonymous said...

Fave

Enyewe you have done s'thing that i wouldn't. ....just decided to ignore some comments...trust me they depress you more....i can stand under anything but insults no i can't do that.

Urxlnc i second you on that we need that report of vision 20-30 ASAP, the one that Oparanya released was a bit unrealistic and i would want to second the comments of AhmedNassir....As much as they want to consolidate support and get applauded they must be real. We have a long way to go and as Sir Alex our standards of governance are too low. Imagine a whole grown person can come and argue here that Kibaki is a better president than Moi,...My foot, give me break who made Moi a standard?

Like minded Kenyans it is time we realze that power is in our hands to right the wrongs that have been committed by the past regimes, Kibaki's included, by the way his was worse it took him only 5 years to bring us on our knees so i am wondering if he had other 10 more years....We will have triple anglo fleecing, 10 more Artur brothers.... economy growth rate will be :"7 *3 = 21%" etc... I rest my case

Ivy

Anonymous said...

Who told you that Raila has fought for democracy? He fought for himself. First of all, he was implicated in the coup, second of all the only reason he fought the wako draft was because the position of prime minister was not in the draft, after Kibaki dis-honoured the gentlemans agreement and thirdly, de-centralization is not as clear cut as Raila makes it out to be, as we do not even have the institutions to make it work properly, most countries in the world that have had decentralisation find the same level of bureaucracy and poor public goods provision exists and unfortunately, the richer regions, such as Nairobi, Rift Valley will have the monopoly when it comes to negotiating for a cut in the budget or other resources such as a highly skilled civil service, leaving poor regions with autonomy but crippling debt. Raila is no hero, infact decentralization had already been started in the 60's, only for Moi to weaken leading stakeholders in the process to keep order. Raila rides on the coat tails of others.

Anonymous said...

The main point of my article is that American voters, at least the Democrats thus far were able to look beyond the bs and vote for issues that really truly mattered, if we Kenyans did this also, Raila for what ever his faults are is the best candidate amongst those being considered. Also, Why shouldn't Raila be able to go to his home in Bondo, where his family and many of his supporters live. What Molasses scandal, was he convicted in court? Please haters find something substantial to use for your criticism before you allow your ignorance to prevail.
-Barry O

Anonymous said...

anon 7:21

to build kenya its better to identify the issues and state the problem and propose solutions. to punctuate each statement with RAO, takes us back to revolve on the same spot bcoz as you know the next response to your comment will be punctuated with MK. lets just look at the issues, you are against decentralisation because you think there is resource limitations that would hamper effective delivery is what i understand from your comment

UrXlnc

Anonymous said...

anon at 721, why are you proud to be an ignorant fool? You're Right Raila fought for himself, he went to prison for 8 years for himself because it was fun. You are living proof that we are in desperate need of improvment in our schools.

-Barry O

Anonymous said...

anon7:34 AM

I second you on that, name how many people Raila has ordered police to shoot and kill? name one those Raila haters- in 2002 when Raila said kibaki tosha!! and traveled to central province with kibaki- Central province were call him a "Hero" right!! so now that their homeboy kibaki didn't deliver in 2007 now they turn round and call him a kihii

Why didn't kibaki and central province bring up the 82 coup then?? when he was giving them the votes in 2002?? why didn't kibaki and central province call Raila a Kihii then when he was shouting kibaki Tosha when the old geezer was in a wheel chair?? and why didn't they shout then that a kihii will never rule kenya in 2002??

why didn't central Province and Kibaki show their real true Colours then?? I know why because they would have never had a chance to step a leg in staehouse! If Raila Knew then what he knows of kibaki and central Province !!being called a kihii and abused all over!! do you sincerely think that he would have said Kibaki "Tosha" and given the thieving thug a chance in statehouse?? Nope !!! the answer is NOPE and even the kenyans from other tribes would have stopped it happening.

So you kikuyu's with your selective memories should shut up and remember who gave you the chance to be in Statehouse!! you didn't deserve it then and you don't deserve it now!! we will prevail!! you are on your way out for a long long time No kenyan in this generation and even the younger generation will ever forgive the shooting to kill by police and army of innocent kenyans and th torture worse than Nyati house!! you will pay dearly !! our children watched on t.v when innocent kenyans were being gunned down in the name of kibaki taking control of statehouse!! they will not allow it ever again!! even school children all over the country except for central still talk about it- those are our future generation and they learned a big lesson through media!! never allow a kikuyu in power again or else you will all be slaughtered!! PERIOD!!

Anonymous said...

-Mrembo

6:56 AM

I'm surprised that you even think that those email exchanges are Chris's? haven't you learned yet on how the haters clone anything?? have you forgotten how they tried to clone kimekucha?? and were defeated??? go read the mashada blog and that will give you a rough idea how far this haters can go just to praise kibaki and his cronies- they have stolen most of the bloggers id's on Masahda and are using them to post pro kibaki propaganda!!

I'm not surprised that they are attacking Kumekucha now!!

but they will not be able to shut Chris down! let the dying horse kick- but those kicks are not working!!!

Anonymous said...

Except for looks, Obama is indeed like Odinga. Idinga is anti-kikuyu while Obama is anti-white. Exactly why mccain will win with a land slide. Obama will make people like mondale look like big winners.

Of course Obama is anti-white. Whites did not know this inititally, which is why he was winning many predominantly white states. After the exposure of his association with Wright and Farrakhan, whites have been leaving him in droves - which is why Hillary was winning most of the last 10 or so states. Obama was a member of the Trinity church of christ for 20 years. It is here where the most hateful and anti white sermons are preached. Yet Obama left the church only the other day when the theology of this church was exposed. This is so pretentious, just like his now beginning to wear the flag pin(which he had described as false patriotism). You cant vote for some one who hates you. So dont go screaming whites are racists when obama loses. And i hope i will not be called a luo hater just for stating this.

But isnt obama's being anti white ironical? I mean he is mixed race and was brought up by the white side of his family. This should make him more white than black, dont you think?

Muindi, Nairobi.

Anonymous said...

Barry, dont kid yourself, you are the ignorant one to think that Raila is actually doing anything for the people of Kenya, he fought for his own self serving interests, and as a matter of fact that is not something I just made up. If Raila was so righteous as a public servant, why is it that he has never stuck for more than a couple of years to any ideology? one minute he's socialist, the next he's nationalist, the next he's democratic, next he'll be far-left... he moves to the most profitable cause for his bank account like everybody else, and you are foolish to think that he is our saviour. One thing is for sure, he better prove us sceptics wrong, because he sells alot of ideas, but execution is another matter. As for the decentralization, yes, he cannot just suggest

As for decentralization when resources are so limited that the poorer regions and municipalities will be forced into further debt. the central goverment whilst giving autonomy in terms of budgetary spending cannot just distribute revenue that is earned in the cities or profitable provinces, it will take at least 10 years of tax reform, institutional building and gathering consensus between locals, businesses etc. Raila makes it sound like by next year we will have decentralized. It is necessary to do so, but it has to be done properly, otherwise we will end up with more fighting.

Anonymous said...

Y'all complain about the kyuks, they also fought for independence, they have every right as a kenyan, to peacefully co-exist with others in their home kenyan. This thing of blaming evry kyuk for the faults of a few is old old old! some of the poorest people are also kyuks! Dont you think they've got the point? You dont like them, fine, you think they are thieves fine, the fact is you can never prove that all kyuks are these things.

Anonymous said...

Anon at 454 you have further accentuated your ignorance, do you realize it is possible to be democratic, socialist and nationalist at the same time? Furthermore, I never said Raila was our saviour I said he was the best candidate amonst those being mentioned. See if you could see past your hate you would have taken that into consideration. Just say you don't like or that you hate him, but don't utter foolish things using terms you don't understand. Kindly find some time to further your education because you come across as a mental midget!! Oh yead and to Muindi, Nairobi @ 12:30 AM please do some research ati Obama is anti-white you clearly only pick up sound bites from the news. Kindly dig your head out of your ass!!

Cheers

-Barry O

Anonymous said...

Barry O,

Cut the abuses. Am interested in Obama's candidacy and have therefore done some research. What I said in my previous post (read it again)is not normally discussed in the media because most media organisations dont want to be seen to be attacking someone from an "oppressed" group. I know what whites think as opposed to what they say to polsters. Hillary knew and that is why she stayed to the end.

Muindi, Nairobi

Anonymous said...

first of all barry you dont have to insult people to state your point. Isnt this a discussion/forum where you air your views and opinions, flawed or unflawed? You must have a dominant ideology if you are a genuine politician, because if you understand human behaviour and interactions, it is personal beliefs that play a key role in objectives for a politician or anyone for that matter. Raila is basically a wolf in sheep's clothing, because he claims to be a believer in so many ideologies, but from he says, it is obvious that he belongs to one, but for the sake of voting he supports even the polar opposite ideology that in no way reflects his political actions. So in a nutshell, he must have at least one dominant ideology, and as he choses to lie to our faces, he is nothing more than the same person as the rest of the politicians. And no i do not hate him, I just do not support him, because he is too shrewd, im not convinced that he does have kenyans interests in mind, so i will no endorse him, just like the rest of the others. Please take your rage elsewhere, you seem to think that calling me ignorant and uneducated justifies your foolish verbal diarrhoea.

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